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reply from Koni

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tencate

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reply from Koni
« on: February 08, 2016, 03:37:52 PM »
James,

B B B B B B B B B B B B B B B  Thank you for contacting us here at KONI

NA. Unfortunately, the 80 1680 has not been superseded with a new part number

since it was discontinued. For a discontinued part number to be brought back

into production, typically a KONI dealer must take exclusive rights to that

particular shocks and requires that the dealer to order a minimum of 50 car

sets or more.



>>>

SOOOO, the dealer that was doing the Stag might be coerced

into also doing shocks for the TR7 and TR8? I'm sure we'd need a solid 50 car

sets though before a dealer would consider such a proposition. Wonder what

"exclusive rights" means?



I'll set up a Survey Monkey or something and let's

see if we can get a commitment for 50 car sets? Or would someone like Moss or

Woody or Ted be able to set up something and we then order from them? I'm not

quite sure how to proceed here. I, for one, would very much like to see

another batch of these made. :-)



Thoughts everyone?



Jim

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Daniel C Jones

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2016, 03:47:50 PM »
You might try R.D. Enterprises (http://www.shox.com/).  I believe they

are Koni dealers.



Dan Jones

Randall Glass

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2016, 06:50:06 PM »
Can you give us an idea of what makes these better, at least in your opinion?

And just to play devils' advocate, are we sure the quality of new ones would

be the same as the old ones? Is it possible that manufacturing techniques have

changed such that new ones would have a different feel than the original

ones?



>

tencate

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Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2016, 12:24:46 AM »
It's all pretty subjective, I'm the first to admit that. There aren't many of

us who have swapped out and tried all the various combinations of front struts

and rear shocks. Jack McGahey has, I've tried most of what's available (NOT

AVOs though) fairly recently, Beans over on the old triumphtr7.com forum has a

lot of experience too. As has David Huddleson. Anyone else here tried a bunch

of these? Speak up! We all have different combinations of suspension bushes

and springs, I've stuck with rubber and uprated rubber most everywhere, stock

springs too. As I recall, all of the folks aboveB are fans of Konis (although

David Huddleson is, I think, fond of SPAX too and hatesB that the Konis for

our cars are SUCH a pain to adjust). I'll let them speak up on the topic

(although you'll probably have to go digging into the triumphtr7.com forum

archives to find what Beans has to say about Konis as he's not on this list

AFAIK). I'm also curious to hear what others think since my opinion is only my

opinion :-)



KonisB areB adjustable. But only the rebound. Compression (or

bump) is fixed and feels just about right to me. I rather like the BL

Motorsports memo comments on the stock suspension and shocks (and these

comments were about a stock North American specB TR8, NOT a TR7) so I'll paste

them in here:



>>>

The standard units [rear shocks] seem to be about right on

bump setting but, as the front, lack rebound capacity. Some adjustable units

have been o,tted to the rear and are set to give a good compromise between

ride and handling.B The bump setting at the rear has a very great effect on

ride comfort, the occupants being close to the rear axle and any large

increase over standard bump makes the ride harsh.



Armstrong are willing to

make a setB of trial units, testing the adjustable units to arrive at the

required setting.

<<<



Konis let you adjust that rebound setting. SPAX and GAZ

stiffen up or soften BOTH bump and rebound together right? KYBs on the rear

are simply too bumpy for my tastes.B KonisB ARE a PITA to adjust but once set,

they feel right whether auto crossing or cruising down I-40 at great highway

speeds.



So, in summary, and in my humble opinion, nothing beats a set of

Konis on the rear of our cars. But others may have opinions too so I'm all

ears :-) Let the discussion begin!

TritonTR8@aol.com

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2016, 10:41:08 AM »
In a message dated 2/8/2016 6:50:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  

rg_spb@me.com writes:



Can you  give us an idea of what makes these better, at least in your

opinion?

And  just to play devils' advocate, are we sure the quality of new ones

would

be  the same as the old ones? Is it possible that manufacturing techniques  

have

changed such that new ones would have a different feel than the  original

ones?

 

 

What makes Konis so much better than anything else is the DIFFERENCE  

between hi speed compression (what happens when you hit a bump or pot  hole) and

low speed compression (what happens when you are cornering hard)  is so MUCH

GREATER than any other shock available for these cars. This is a  product

of Koni's internal valve design - which certainly should not be expected  to

change and shouldn't be affected by any change in mfg technique.

As Jim mentioned in another reply, some years ago, when I was autocrossing  

TR8s in SCCA E Stock on R Compound tires, I experimented with a number of  

different shocks on more than one TR8 - since this was arguably the only  

variable we could change in SCCA Stock at the time. Nothing was as good as

Koni.  One example: one of the TR8s we bought was in really good shape and had  

almost-new Spax adjustables on it at the time. I couldn't wait to get rid

of  them - they were utter junk IMO - the car immediately handled AND rode

better  with Konis.

A word about shock adjustment: I believe it is a mistake to think of Konis  

as adjustable for tuning for performance - they are adjustable to

compensate for  wear over time - after some experimentation, I always set them one

turn up from  full soft and never felt the need to go back and readjust them.

Therefore the  fact that you have to remove the shocks from the car to

adjust them is of no  consequence to me.

 

A word about autocrossing TR8s - I no longer autocross a stock TR8 anywhere

 but the occasional Triumph club or VTR event. SCCA rule changes have

eliminated  the Stock category all together - a Stock TR8 would now be in E

Street, required  to run on tires with a wear index of at least 200 and run

against stiffer  competition than there was in the old E Stock class.

I now run a more modern car on "street" tires in SCCA events. Since I  no

longer buy Hossier A6 tires, it is a lot cheaper, but i do occasionally  

experience Purple Crack withdrawal.

 

Cheers,

Jack Mc

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TritonTR8@aol.com

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2016, 10:43:44 AM »
In a message dated 2/9/2016 12:24:39 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,  

tencate@mac.com writes:



a  KONI

dealer must take exclusive rights to that

particular shocks and  requires that

the dealer to order a minimum of 50 car

sets or  more.

 

 

FWIW, I'd be a buyer for 2 sets - if that would help make it  happen

 

Cheers,

Jack Mc

--

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Archives provided courtesy  http://www.triumphwedgeowners.org

"Bill Derksen"

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2016, 11:23:42 AM »
Thanks for the additional input, Jack.

B

How are the Konis for comfort/handling on the street vs autocross? I

only autocross at VTR-type events as well, but I also have a pretty

long drive to get to them. How to they compare to KYB's for longevity?

B

I have nothing to compare to, but my KYB's seem pretty stiff on the

street, but it seems like I get a lot of body lean while autocrossing...

B

I'll throw my hat in the ring for a set, too.

B

Cheers

Bill

Stephen Sanders

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2016, 12:49:13 PM »
Did TR7's come with Konis stock?  I'd would be more oh so interested in the

comfort/handling part too.



I'm sold.....Jack Mc is a good salesman.  Just how expensive could a set of

Konis might be?  If not to prohibitive I might be convinced to change out my

entire fleet of Wedges each with a set of Konis.  Unless they end up costing

like the set of $200 Bilstein's for my BMW, I might have to start saving now

or reconsider my options.



Regards,

Steve Sanders

sasande@hotmail.com

1976 DATSUN 280Z

1980 TRIUMPH TR7 DHC FI SPIDER TPZDJ8AA401562

1981 TRIUMPH TR8 DHC FI SATPZ4583BA406399

1981 TRIUMPH TR8 DHC FI SATPV4589BA405205

1997 FORD THUNDERBIRD

2002 BMW M3

WILLIAMSBURG, VIRGINIA

Odd Hedberg

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2016, 01:09:59 PM »
AfaIk the Koni units are rebuild-able, most other brands aren't...



OK, it's only a faint memory from my youth but still - I'm sure I

remember a guy

(working at the time for Vhlins in UpplandsVdsby) stating the above when we

met at a Spitfire gathering in about '80 or so...



/Odd



On 2016-02-09 at 06:24 James Tencate wrote:

Wayne Simpson

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2016, 02:25:56 PM »

tencate

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Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2016, 03:26:37 PM »
Koni spec'd different part numbers for the Stag vs the TR7/8. So the Stag Konis will fit but that wasn't what Koni designed for the car.



That said, anyone fitted Stag Konis to their TR7 or 8?

charles frink

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2016, 05:19:28 PM »
Has anyone tried GAZ shocks ?

tencate

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Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2016, 06:16:13 PM »
Yes, me. Write me offline if you want my opinion on them...

Bill

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2016, 09:56:26 PM »
Drove a buddies 187 RWHP Ford 2.3 Turbo with GAZ shocks.  Ride was much

better damped in a smooth way.  Konis in the front require you to drop

the strut to adjust them.  A real PITA to get them dialed in and you

can't tighten them up for the occasional autocross.  I thought the Konis

were either too soft, or when firm enough were too sharp over the rough

northeast ohio roads.   So I switched to spax, which let me adjust them

more easily but they seem to have the same issue to an even greater degree.



The GAZ were the bomb, I thought 'gotta get me some of these'.  But this

was at least 10 years ago when they were new to the market.  I cannot

comment on current quality or durability.  Only that they felt

immediately superior to what I was used to when I drove on them, on the

kind of roads we have 'round here.



I suspect Konis might work much better if you live in, say, SoCal.

johntrlucas@aol.com

Re: reply from Koni
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2016, 01:58:40 AM »
johntrlucas@aol.com









Hi,





Got Gaz fitted all round on my TR7 V8, found them every bit as good as the Spax I had fitted to a previous car. The coating on the outside of the rear shocks has certainly fared better than the paint on the Spax. Fronts and rear are easy to adjust with a setting suitable for most I would guess even on the appalling roads we have over here ! Had them 7 - 8 years with no problems.





Cheers John